Transformers Ongoing #11: Reactions, Reviews, Spoilers

Transformers is here! Discuss anything TF-related.

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Postby hook line and sinker » Fri Oct 08, 2010 4:29 am

The new storyline seems promising. And really I would love to see the idw verse get back on its feet!
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Postby hook line and sinker » Fri Oct 08, 2010 4:29 am

The new storyline seems promising. And really I would love to see the idw verse get back on its feet!
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Postby Fantomas » Fri Oct 08, 2010 9:20 am

Cattleprod wrote:People keep bringing up how 'slow' Infiltration was. You know how long it took for Transformers to actively be hanging around in robot mode? Three issues, one of which was the 99 cent preview. And in the course of those issues, we had one of the best choreographed car chase scenes ever in a Transformers comic. By the end of Infiltration, things were definitely going at a good clip.

The ongoing is at #11, and I'm still complaining about how slow things are. And it's not for lack of action, there's been plenty of fighting along the way. It just feels so dragged out. The Menasor battle felt empty, roughly half the guys said to be at the site never even appeared on panel. The Combaticons invading South Korea wasn't exciting and tense, it was just there. Conversations are dragged across far more pages than are necessary. That 16 page Infiltration preview mentioned above felt more like a complete issue than any 22 page issue of the ongoing.

There's a difference between telling a story slowly and just being poorly paced. Infiltration was the former, and the ongoing is sadly the latter.


Ditto.

We had an excellent Ultimates version of the Transformers, not perfect but something that keeps me entertained. Or fill with wonder (SL : Shockwave, SL : Hardhead, etc.).

Now we had Simon Furman stuck in the movieverse and Rocherts not in charge of the Ongoing. Something is wrong.
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Postby DanielW » Fri Oct 08, 2010 5:25 pm

I still think "Rocherts" needs to stay in miniseries.
the next one needs to be a Decepticon-y one.
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Postby hook line and sinker » Fri Oct 08, 2010 11:44 pm

It should be obvious from these forums that the same folks are reading these books now who were there for the original run of furmans work. Idw can clearly see that crushing the tf universe by rushing the last few ations storylines and then with the ongoing debacle didnt bring in any new readers, and just opting to forget major plot points like ore 13 and the decline of the con empire wasnt ok with fans in the least. Bludgeon miraculously restored and fighting for megatron again, starscream forgetting his own character development, the predacons working for china, and optimus prime submitting to the armed forces after waging a bitter war of attrition which ravaged countless worlds for thousands of years----THESE are plot ideas which we could stand to see just dumped, rather than the depth of the earlier idw-verse...
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Postby Max_Rawhide » Sat Oct 09, 2010 1:41 am

Truth be told, I wasn't completely in awe with the -tion series.

I really liked the original idea of that series with the whole abandoned Cybertron, the galactic scope of the stories, the military structure, and the concept of the Infiltration units.

That was all excellent. (And all parts that were discarded.)

But for me, the story went downhill fast with the introduction of The Reapers and the Dead Universe.

The first one served absolutely no purpose other then causing the reveal of the Decepticons on Earth (although that was already blown when Sixshot was used) and the wavering loyalty of Sixshot.

The Dead Universe...well, the Gorlam Prime part was interesting as was a Galvatron/Cyclonus/Swoop that wasn't Unicron related. But they still had this near mystical background.


But all in all, still a whole lot better than AHM and the current Ongoing.
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Postby hook line and sinker » Sat Oct 09, 2010 6:12 am

Well, ive said myself here that I really didnt enjoy either Devastation or Revelation for the same reasons. It never works for me when they bring in some exra cosmic enemy to fight the tfs(like the reapers)unless its unicron.
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Postby bassbot » Sat Oct 09, 2010 2:10 pm

Max_Rawhide wrote:The Dead Universe...well, the Gorlam Prime part was interesting as was a Galvatron/Cyclonus/Swoop that wasn't Unicron related. But they still had this near mystical background.


ahem, Swoop's a dinobot. You're referring to Scourge. :)
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Postby Matrix » Sun Oct 10, 2010 10:44 am

hook line and sinker wrote:Idw can clearly see that crushing the tf universe by rushing the last few ations storylines and then with the ongoing debacle didnt bring in any new readers,


Except it seemingly did. There's certainly a large influx of female readership that arrived during AHM, and IDW continuously insist that AHM was a big success, with rising figures that were better than Devastation.

The Diamond sales figures for the US seemed to be the same, but sales abroad must have increased. So they say, anyway. My point is: you're a pleb. ;) What might seem obvious to you is more than likely wrong unless you have any inside info.

As for Devastation onwards: yes. God yes. Furman's dialogue utterly disintegrated, and the idea of super-threats that cause factions to team up was simply a Unicron story in new clothes.

This applies to Thunderwing, The Reapers, the Dead Universe... it was just endless recycled storytelling without any true concentration on character development.
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Postby musicman79 » Sun Oct 10, 2010 11:14 am

Max_Rawhide wrote:Truth be told, I wasn't completely in awe with the -tion series.

I really liked the original idea of that series with the whole abandoned Cybertron, the galactic scope of the stories, the military structure, and the concept of the Infiltration units.

That was all excellent. (And all parts that were discarded.)

But for me, the story went downhill fast with the introduction of The Reapers and the Dead Universe.

The first one served absolutely no purpose other then causing the reveal of the Decepticons on Earth (although that was already blown when Sixshot was used) and the wavering loyalty of Sixshot.

The Dead Universe...well, the Gorlam Prime part was interesting as was a Galvatron/Cyclonus/Swoop that wasn't Unicron related. But they still had this near mystical background.


But all in all, still a whole lot better than AHM and the current Ongoing.


This is something I've thought about. For me Furman's run hit its peak with Escalation. And then an interesting storyline that could have been developed in so many different directions just got shoved under the rug for that same old tired Furman storyline (just in different clothing) in Devastation. Ugh. I've seen all that before, too many times.

I do not now, nor have I ever had any use for the Reapers as a plot device. Simply did not work for me. The Dead Universe held my interest for as long as there was some mystery (which wasn't long) but by Devastation that was gone.

People have complained again and again about the sudden change of direction for the worse in AHM, but really there had already been an unneeded change of direction for the worse. And if AHM (which I did initially dislike, I admit) had not come along when it did, I wouldn't be here now. There's no way I would have kept spending my money on Furman's storyline. So in at least my case, AHM succeeded in its goal.

I'm back on the fence now, though... the ongoing has improved since issue 8 (the low point of IDW's Transformer comics, to me) but improvment has brought it up only to average, and it needs more than that to survive.
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Postby HighlordGalvatron » Sun Oct 10, 2010 12:40 pm

Matrix wrote:
hook line and sinker wrote:Idw can clearly see that crushing the tf universe by rushing the last few ations storylines and then with the ongoing debacle didnt bring in any new readers,


Except it seemingly did. There's certainly a large influx of female readership that arrived during AHM, and IDW continuously insist that AHM was a big success, with rising figures that were better than Devastation.

The Diamond sales figures for the US seemed to be the same, but sales abroad must have increased. So they say, anyway. My point is: you're a pleb. ;) What might seem obvious to you is more than likely wrong unless you have any inside info.

As for Devastation onwards: yes. God yes. Furman's dialogue utterly disintegrated, and the idea of super-threats that cause factions to team up was simply a Unicron story in new clothes.
We even began to see Megatron's mental state decline as he became more and more obsessed with defeating the autobots.

This applies to Thunderwing, The Reapers, the Dead Universe... it was just endless recycled storytelling without any true concentration on character development.


Well, the introduction of thunderwing was a new and interesting take on the pretenders. In my opinion this gave the readers an actual back story telling us how the transformers destroyed their own world and they didnt need much help from an outside force.
Some of Furman's may have been "recycled" but the execution was MUCH better.

The reapers added something new by telling us that there are other races in the universe that are just as strong as the decepticons. Sixshot actually decided to join them was an example of character development. Here is the weapon of war that was longing to find a real meaning to his existence.

We even began to see Megatron's mental state decline as he became more and more obsessed with defeating the autobots. Furman had transformed the characters and made them more adult. Now, we have all the personalities that we saw from the TV show and it just doesnt stick for me now that i am not 7 years old. Personally, I hate to see the autobots waiting around for Optimus Prime to come and save them like issue 6.

AHM was a complete rip-off of season one and two episodes. Go back and review Megatron's master plan 1 and 2, city of steal, divide and conquer and triple takeover and you have AHM nearly word for word.

The only issue of the ongoning that is half way tolerable is the issue of Thundercracker. Other than that the ongoing has been a waste of time and money and it pains me to say this due to the fact that i have read TF comics since 1984.
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Postby Matrix » Sun Oct 10, 2010 2:30 pm

Going to have to completely disagree with you there, mate. Megatron's 'Pah! Screw the plans, I want to kill Prime!' is nowhere near as sophisticated as his portrayal in AHM. It's one of the few things the story did well, I think.

The accusations of 'They're their Sunbow personalities!' is either borne from not reading past the first couple of issues or recycling fan bile. Shane started with characters that seemed familiar, but quickly grew in complexity. Starscream's the main example of this: I was screaming like the rest when his character was 'axed' in AHM, but by the end it was more complex than ever, matching up to - and exceeding - his portrayal in the -ations.
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Postby HighlordGalvatron » Sun Oct 10, 2010 9:51 pm

Matrix wrote:Going to have to completely disagree with you there, mate. Megatron's 'Pah! Screw the plans, I want to kill Prime!' is nowhere near as sophisticated as his portrayal in AHM. It's one of the few things the story did well, I think.

The accusations of 'They're their Sunbow personalities!' is either borne from not reading past the first couple of issues or recycling fan bile. Shane started with characters that seemed familiar, but quickly grew in complexity. Starscream's the main example of this: I was screaming like the rest when his character was 'axed' in AHM, but by the end it was more complex than ever, matching up to - and exceeding - his portrayal in the -ations.



Well, the "Sophisticated" was actually established from the beginning of the IDW run on Transformers. Largely, AHM was focused more on the autobots. A few words on how "Megatron needed them to be a army" really didnt make him more sophisticated.

Actually, i read the entire series and have acutally read it more than a few times. So, my opinion is based on what i read because i DID give it a chance to make a mark. Many of the character's complex personailities had already been established before AHM with the exception of Hot Rod who was turned into a teenager.
Also, Omega Supreme was turned back into the two word only giant rather than the intelligent bot that was shown in Optimus spotlight.

Season 1 characters all over the place with season 2 and few from 3 making guest appearences around issue 5. That is why i call it cartoonish. Not to even mention the whole "Optimus' miracle healing".

So, no this is not "recycling fan bile" as you have put it. This is from actually reading AHM.

I gave AHM the chance that many others didnt not because i IDW won me over when they got the TF's . But AHM was 12 issues of a weak story which has turned into a very weak ongoing.
Sure, it has a few good moments but it was like reading a composite of several season one and two episodes.
Now, compared to the ongoing, AHM seems like gold!!!!!
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Postby MilkManX » Tue Oct 12, 2010 4:19 pm

HighlordGalvatron wrote:
Matrix wrote:I gave AHM the chance that many others didnt not because i IDW won me over when they got the TF's . But AHM was 12 issues of a weak story which has turned into a very weak ongoing.
Sure, it has a few good moments but it was like reading a composite of several season one and two episodes.
Now, compared to the ongoing, AHM seems like gold!!!!!


Could not have said it better myself... :wink:
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